Legislature(1999 - 2000)
04/01/1999 08:07 AM Senate FIN
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* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
SENATE BILL NO. 6
"An Act relating to the disposal of state land."
This was the third hearing for this bill in the Senate
Finance Committee. A motion to adopt and a motion to amend
Amendment #2 were pending from the previous hearing.
Co-Chair John Torgerson directed the Committee's attention
to a proposed committee substitute, 1-LS0071/H, 3/26/99,
the sponsor wanted adopted.
Senator ROBIN TAYLOR, the sponsor of the bill, joined the
Committee and explained that the proposed committee
substitute shifts the obligation for both identifying and
selling State land from the commissioner of the Department
of Natural Resources to a State Land Commission that would
be formed under this legislation. He noted that while the
governor would appoint the members of the land commission,
the commission would report to the legislature and the
process would be subjected to a five-year review period and
a ten-year sunset. This, he stressed, would give the
legislature an opportunity to review and revise the process
as necessary. He described the membership of the
commission, saying it would consist of five members: a real
estate appraiser, a real estate broker, a land surveyor
plus two members of the public appointed at-large. He added
that no more than three members could belong to the same
political party.
Senator Robin Taylor then noted that the committee
substitute also calls for the creation of land disposal
advisory boards in every municipality and borough. Those
areas of the state not included in a borough would also be
represented by advisory boards, he stated, following the
Model Borough Boundary Act to establish the geographic
regions. He stressed that the purpose of the advisory
boards would be to provide local input to the State Land
Commission recommending lands to be offered for sale.
Senator Robin Taylor stated that the intent of this
legislation is to create a land disposal bank that would
have a minimum of 250,000 acres available each year for
disposal by the state.
Senator Robin Taylor pointed out that this legislation
places some limitations on the size of land disposals. The
legislation reads as follows:
".parcels identified as appropriate for sale must
consist of 160 acres or more, except that parcels
identified by an advisory board as suitable for
recreation and homesites must consist of 40 acres or
more, individual parcels in subdivisions intended for
private residential or recreational use may not exceed
five acres."
He also noted that lands must be provided for a variety of
uses such as agricultural, timber and recreational. In
other words, he explained all the lands available for
disposal would not be located in one area or have only one
feasible use.
Senator Robin Taylor stated the committee substitute
provides that lands would be sold at auction and a
provision requires that bidders meet the same Alaskan
residency criteria as dictated in the Permanent Fund
dividend program. He noted that the bidding procedures
would not change from the current practices and that land
not sold through the auction process would then become
available to nonresidents for purchase.
Senator Robin Taylor pointed out that the committee
substitute replaces the word "Commissioner" with
"Commission" in several places in the bill to reflect the
change of authority over the land disposals.
Senator Robin Taylor explained that the committee
substitute establishes that the legislature annually
reviews the lands selected and decides which lands are
offered for disposal.
Senator Robin Taylor summarized by saying that other
language in the committee substitute is basically
housekeeping items to state the terms of the commission
members. However, he noted the absence of earlier clean-up
language that was added to an earlier committee substitute
regarding the appraisal system. He did not know why the
language was omitted and felt it should be included.
Co-Chair John Torgerson guessed the language was omitted
due to changes made to the provisions governing auctions.
Senator Pete Kelly asked if the committee substitute
contained a mechanism for land that is put up for auction
but not sold. Senator Robin Taylor replied that the land
would accrue in a "land bank", which is the current
practice. He thought that the land bank currently contains
45 to 50 thousand acres that are surveyed and placed up for
public sale. He noted that most of that land is property
earlier sold but returned to the State for various reasons
such as default on payment.
Senator Robin Taylor added that this bill began as an
effort to force the Department of Natural Resources to sell
land held in the land bank.
Co-Chair John Torgerson referred to the provision on page
3, beginning at line 26 of the committee substitute
directing the Department of Natural Resources to dispose of
land held in the land bank. He asked if there should be a
cap on the amount of land held in the land bank. He had
concerns with the wording, "disposed of". He suggested
using, "offered" instead so that the department is not
forced to simply give the land away. Senator Robin Taylor
felt that a cap should be placed. Co-Chair John Torgerson
qualified that he had not had much time to study the bill
and that this hearing was intended as an overview.
Senator Loren Leman shared Co-Chair John Torgerson's
concern about the implication of the phrase "shall be
disposed of". He also had concerns about the minimum and
maximum parcel size stipulations. He thought the witness'
testimony did not accurately reflect the language of the
committee substitute. Senator Robin Taylor clarified his
earlier statement.
Senator Loren Leman wanted to know the reason for the
minimum size restrictions for recreation use lands and
homesites. He suggested there could be some areas smaller
than forty acres that would be suitable for these uses such
as around Lake Clark. Senator Robin Taylor replied that he
has been working with the department to draft the bill's
provisions. He learned that the cost of disposal of small
parcels becomes unfeasible for the State. He qualified that
he did not believe there should be any of the size
limitations. For example, he wanted the land managers to
dispose of the state's bug infested timberlands in any way
possible for the purpose of cleaning up the land and
reforestation. He stated, "trying to legislate common sense
is very difficult." His intent with this legislation is to
give the department perimeters and he was willing to amend
the bill in any way to effectively achieve this.
Senator Loren Leman suggested a fallback position
stipulating that the size provisions will be standard
except when a finding is made showing that another method
is more appropriate. He stressed that he did not want the
department to use the size provisions as an excuse to not
dispose of certain lands.
Co-Chair John Torgerson noted his efforts along with the
sponsor's to establish a land disposal commission. He felt
that more needed to be done on this legislation before it
could be reported from Committee. He wanted the committee
substitute distributed to the department for
recommendations on how to further refine the bill.
Senator Lyda Green moved for adoption of CS SB 6, 1-
LS007/H, 3/26/99 as a Workdraft. It was ADOPTED without
objection.
Senator Dave Donley was concerned that the title is so
specific that he was unsure if the other body would support
the legislation. He wanted to know if the stipulation that
250,000 acres must be distributed annually could be deleted
from the title. Senator Robin Taylor responded that he was
not bound by any number and that he only used 250,000 as a
starting point. He stressed that he was open to
suggestions. Senator Dave Donley stated that he thought a
generic figure would be more appropriate. Co-Chair John
Torgerson agreed and felt 250,000 acres is aggressive
especially if it is to be an annually reoccurring disposal.
Senator Loren Leman moved to amend the committee substitute
to delete "250,000 acres of" from page 1 line 2, the title.
Co-Chair John Torgerson said the motion could be made but
the Committee would then need to come back with a new
committee substitute. He preferred to incorporate this
change along with other suggestions into one committee
substitute rather than make a few small changes here and
there. Senator Loren Leman withdrew his motion.
Co-Chair John Torgerson ordered SB 6 held in Committee.
Co-Chair John Torgerson explained that the meeting will
recess until 9:00 AM when the teleconference is connected
to allow public testimony on the State's budget.
Senator Gary Wilken asked if the Senate Resolution
regarding crowning the Women of Senate Finance as Alaskan
royalty would be heard today. Co-Chair John Torgerson said
the resolution would be taken under advisement. He noted
that the Senate Finance Secretary's office did not file the
resolution in a timely manner. Senator Gary Wilken
suggested the resolution be referred to a number of
subcommittees for consideration. Co-Chair John Torgerson
agreed and appointed Senator Gary Wilken as chair of the
first subcommittee; Senator Loren Leman as chair of the
second; Senator Dave Donley as chair of the third; Senator
Lyda Green as chair of the forth and Senator Pete Kelly as
chair of the fifth subcommittee. Senator Lyda Green
protested that the Committee was not advancing the
legislation in support of the Women of Senate Finance.
[APRIL FOOLS!!]
AT EASE until 9:05AM/9:06AM
Co-Chair Sean Parnell noted this portion of the meeting was
set aside for public testimony on long range solutions for
the state's fiscal situation. There was no one present to
testify so the Committee addressed the next bill on the
agenda with the understanding that it would be set aside if
anyone arrived wishing to testify on the budget.
AT EASE 9:07AM/9:09AM
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